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Post by Super Communist on Feb 19, 2012 15:35:45 GMT -5
That's because herbivores grow to much larger sizes. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megalodon"The megalodon ( /ˈmɛɡələdɒn/ meg-ə-lə-don; meaning "big tooth", from Greek μέγας (mega, "big") and ὀδούς (odon, "tooth")) is an extinct species of shark that lived roughly from 28 to 1.5 million years ago, during the Cenozoic Era (late Oligocene to early Pleistocene)." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livyatan_melvillei"Livyatan melvillei is an extinct species of physeteroid whale, which lived during the Miocene epoch, approximately 12-13 million years ago." Birds are not dinosaurs they are descendants. And its not unreasonable to assume that they will be outlasted by reptiles. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extinct_birdsIn five hundred years one hundred ninety species of birds have gone extinct and the extinction rate is still increasing.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Feb 19, 2012 15:47:59 GMT -5
The ora (komodo dragon) has retained its title as apex predator of the island system despite the fact that feral dogs, large mamalian pack predators, are also present on the islands and are active predators. If mammals were truly so much superior the ora population would be taking major hits. The perentie fights off packs of dingoes (from what ive read on theses sites, so take your grain of salt), The crocodile remains The predatory ruler of the fresh waterways and in some cases the salt too but all that means nothing, your place on the food chain means nothing, other than what you eat, the fact that you were using it as an example of superiority shows how childish your mind still is (I eat you so im better). longevity, diversity, adaptiblity and population is what determines the success of animals and ectotheremes have us licked there (the only place we might have them is adaptibilty) but im going to retain the belief that niether is truly better. As for ectotheremic vertebrates never acheiving flight? wasnt it flying Reptiles that dominated the skies above the heads of your precious dinosaurs.
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 19, 2012 18:01:07 GMT -5
So is it fair to compare warm-blooded herbivores with cold-blooded herbivores? Name one cold-blooded herbivore of that size. When you said Livyatan died out before Megalodon, I thought you meant they never existed together. Livyatan was the apex predator, above Megalodon. Birds are Dinosaurs. Where do you draw the line? In any case, the first Dinosaur still has a living ancestor, meaning it was not out lasted. Pterosaurs were warm-blooded. Fine, your precious lizards get one little island while the mammals rule the rest of the planet. Why do you get to define "better"? In my opinion overall dominance is more important. Besides, like I said warm-blooded animals have existed since they first evolved, so longevity is not a valid argument.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Feb 19, 2012 18:19:23 GMT -5
reptile fill the nitch of top predator of most tropical freshwater systems. Oceanic systems, predators like the orca are capable of killing sharks but I'm not sure I can say they out compete them. Wherever there is a tropical forest inhabited by a big cat there is always an equally successful big snake.
The biggest areas of the world however, the abyss deep beneathe the waves is ruled by cold blooded cephalapods and has been since moss ruled the land.
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 19, 2012 18:28:05 GMT -5
Fine, you've found one ecosystem where ectotherms are superior. Orcas are superior to any shark.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Feb 19, 2012 18:30:17 GMT -5
So is it fair to compare warm-blooded herbivores with cold-blooded herbivores? Name one cold-blooded herbivore of that size. When you said Livyatan died out before Megalodon, I thought you meant they never existed together. Livyatan was the apex predator, above Megalodon. Birds are Dinosaurs. Where do you draw the line? In any case, the first Dinosaur still has a living ancestor, meaning it was not out lasted. Pterosaurs were warm-blooded. Fine, your precious lizards get one little island while the mammals rule the rest of the planet. Why do you get to define "better"? In my opinion overall dominance is more important. Besides, like I said warm-blooded animals have existed since they first evolved, so longevity is not a valid argument. Pterosaurs were warm blooded? prove it. oh wait you cant and there reptiles, part of being a reptile is cold blood. silly dino fans The lizard gets several islands learn to count Your opinion is childish, which is more successful cats or ants? longevity is clearly in there favour, they have a huge head start on us, ectotherems could die out right now and still beat us in overall age.
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 19, 2012 18:37:29 GMT -5
Like I said, overall age is not a fair comparison because ectotherms existed before endotherms. Pterosaurs were warm blooded? prove it. oh wait you cant and there reptiles, part of being a reptile is cold blood. silly dino fans Wtf is this? Pterosaurs had pycnofibers, indicating they were warm-blooded. Also their lifestyle was to energetic for a cold-blooded animal. I'll smite you for being a dumbass.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Feb 19, 2012 19:03:11 GMT -5
Like I said, overall age is not a fair comparison because ectotherms existed before endotherms. Pterosaurs were warm blooded? prove it. oh wait you cant and there reptiles, part of being a reptile is cold blood. silly dino fans Wtf is this? Pterosaurs had pycnofibers, indicating they were warm-blooded. Also their lifestyle was to energetic for a cold-blooded animal. I'll smite you for being a dumbass. Its an on going debate and tiny hairs hardly prove warm blood. I'll triple smite you for being an arrogant turd. If you appologize il restore your karma.
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Post by Super Communist on Feb 19, 2012 19:55:41 GMT -5
You made your point, but still it seems that cold blooded predators have the potential to become much larger than warm blooded ones. That is unlikely since Megalodon was larger and there is no evidence of Livyatan being a pack hunter. 10000birds.com/are-birds-really-dinosaurs.htmSaying dinosaurs are birds is like saying monkeys are apes.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Feb 19, 2012 20:18:29 GMT -5
the deep zone is by far the largest ecosystem on earth!
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 19, 2012 22:01:39 GMT -5
Most modern cetaceans live in pods. That's evidence enough I think.
Dinosauria has been defined as Triceratops, birds, their most recent common ancestor, and all descendants. The original definition I believe was Iguanodon, Megalosaurus, their most recent common ancestor, and all descendants, but even when you don't include birds in the definition they fit in the "all descendants" clause. Birds are Dinosaurs.
Well, when endotherms and ectotherms live together, the endotherms are dominant.
And Venom, at least my opinion is backed by some evidence. You have no evidence for your claim at all. And remember when you said I was being a bad moderator by insulting you? Think it through next time.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Feb 19, 2012 23:31:29 GMT -5
You insulted me first and the point i was trying to make is that you cant prove it either way, so you cant actually say im wrong. You calling me a "dumbass" is completely unfounded, me calling you an arrogant turd on the other hand is a little less baseless. Flys have little hairs, so do bees, wasps, mosquitoes. they are all also ectothermic. dragons dominate dogs, crocs dominate a butt load of things, large pythons and boas do aswell.
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 19, 2012 23:41:02 GMT -5
the point i was trying to make is that you cant prove it either way, so you cant actually say im wrong. Why didn't you just say that? You called me silly. And you were the first one to insult on FFO also, and you criticized me for doing exactly what you are now. Hypocrite.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Feb 20, 2012 0:00:55 GMT -5
Everyones a hypocrite and silly? really? And as i recall my isnults were not nearly as insulting as dumbass.
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Post by Tyrannosaurus on Feb 20, 2012 0:43:50 GMT -5
The first insult between us was you saying you "overestimated my intelligence". I can think of few insults more maddening, personally. You really pissed me off from the get go.
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