Reticulatus
Ichthyoid
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Post by Reticulatus on Jan 4, 2012 16:16:34 GMT -5
Dose anyone know if false gharials death roll? If they do that definately effects the outcome of an aquatic confrontation.
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Post by Canid Cetus Aves on Jan 4, 2012 16:37:47 GMT -5
It might. If it does then, it could get a good bite on the Jaguar and perform a death role. That would be effective.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Jan 4, 2012 16:46:39 GMT -5
My thoughts exactly. The jaguar might be able to break free from a simple bite and drag scenerio but IF it can death roll the disorientation and motion might take some of the fight out of the jaguar.
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Post by Canid Cetus Aves on Jan 4, 2012 22:48:08 GMT -5
Like I said, the Gharial has weak jaws. So I think unless is got a really good bite onto the Jaguar, the Jaguar would be able to get of a bite.
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Post by Ultimategrid on Jan 5, 2012 9:19:59 GMT -5
Well a man was recently killed by a false gharial, if you do not consider humans large prey then what is considered large prey? We have no way to know if a fisherman was killed by a gharial or different crocodile or drowned. All they found is remains of fisherman in a gharial's stomache. It is a freak case. Indian gharials was once labelled maneaters because they have human remains in their stomaches. Turns out that Indian Gharials have feeding on human corpses from Hindu funeral burial ritual. I don't fancy the gharial's chances against a jaguar, no matter how big the gharial is, it is ill suited to tackle down a 150+ lbs robust cat. orangutanfoundation.wildlifedirect.org/2009/01/23/endangered-crocodile-species-kills-local-man/It's evident that is was indeed the tomistoma that killed the man. I seriously doubt the cat's ability to kill a 600lb crocodilian. I have never even heard of a jaguar killing a black caiman, and caiman far far less aggressive than other crocodilians with much less stamina. I am surprised at how many people are underestimating the tomistoma's chances. Where are all these records of felines killing big crocodilians? To my knowledge there is no record of a healthy adult crocodilian being taken by a single cat. I've seen a video involving a sick, old, dehydrated, 12ft mugger crocodile being taken by a tiger. And I've seen videos of a small (10ft) crocodile being killed by a pride of lions, but I have never seen a large crocodilian with the exception of caiman being taken by a cat. I am beginning to think it can't happen.
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Post by Ultimategrid on Jan 5, 2012 9:22:09 GMT -5
Like I said, the Gharial has weak jaws. So I think unless is got a really good bite onto the Jaguar, the Jaguar would be able to get of a bite. It has weak jaws COMPARED TO OTHER CROCODILIANS. It doesn't have weak jaws in general, it actually has rather strong jaws as far as animals go, but they simply aren't as strong as that of a crocodile or alligator. It has by far enough power to drag a jaguar into the water.
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Taurus
Invertebrate
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Post by Taurus on Jan 5, 2012 10:22:10 GMT -5
We have no way to know if a fisherman was killed by a gharial or different crocodile or drowned. All they found is remains of fisherman in a gharial's stomache. It is a freak case. Indian gharials was once labelled maneaters because they have human remains in their stomaches. Turns out that Indian Gharials have feeding on human corpses from Hindu funeral burial ritual. I don't fancy the gharial's chances against a jaguar, no matter how big the gharial is, it is ill suited to tackle down a 150+ lbs robust cat. orangutanfoundation.wildlifedirect.org/2009/01/23/endangered-crocodile-species-kills-local-man/It's evident that is was indeed the tomistoma that killed the man. I seriously doubt the cat's ability to kill a 600lb crocodilian. I have never even heard of a jaguar killing a black caiman, and caiman far far less aggressive than other crocodilians with much less stamina. I am surprised at how many people are underestimating the tomistoma's chances. Where are all these records of felines killing big crocodilians? To my knowledge there is no record of a healthy adult crocodilian being taken by a single cat. I've seen a video involving a sick, old, dehydrated, 12ft mugger crocodile being taken by a tiger. And I've seen videos of a small (10ft) crocodile being killed by a pride of lions, but I have never seen a large crocodilian with the exception of caiman being taken by a cat. I am beginning to think it can't happen. The problem with you use the term crocodilians in general. Gharials are quite different from caimans and crocodiles that other big cats deal with. Gharials are ill suited to tackle down large animals and they do poorly in interspecific conflicts. The only thing a gharial has is a size but that's it. Not mentioned that gharials are ill suited for combat on land due to the aquatic life style. There's no evidence that False Gharial has killed a fisherman, all they found is some human remains in a gharial's stomache.
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Taurus
Invertebrate
Posts: 162
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Post by Taurus on Jan 5, 2012 10:26:13 GMT -5
Like I said, the Gharial has weak jaws. So I think unless is got a really good bite onto the Jaguar, the Jaguar would be able to get of a bite. It has weak jaws COMPARED TO OTHER CROCODILIANS. It doesn't have weak jaws in general, it actually has rather strong jaws as far as animals go, but they simply aren't as strong as that of a crocodile or alligator. It has by far enough power to drag a jaguar into the water. Not excatly, it's jaws and teeth design is ill suited for dragging something large in the water. Also it is poorly design to holding a large struggling animal. It is not that uncommon for gharials to have jaws broken.
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Post by Felis Rex on Jan 5, 2012 20:29:09 GMT -5
Although most of these caimen arent impressive, the one at around 2:00 looks fairly large. Take into consideration that a jaguar is a rare sight in the wild, and there are so many videos of them feeding on caimen and other reptiles, one could draw the conclusion that they make up a large portion of their diet. I have little doubt that the jaguar would take all but the largest false gharial. On the other hand the False Gharial has little to no chance of killing the cat as it has evolved hunting similar large reptiles.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Jan 5, 2012 20:56:37 GMT -5
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Post by Anomonyous on Jan 5, 2012 23:47:53 GMT -5
The problem with you use the term crocodilians in general. Gharials are quite different from caimans and crocodiles that other big cats deal with. Gharials are ill suited to tackle down large animals and they do poorly in interspecific conflicts. The only thing a gharial has is a size but that's it. Not mentioned that gharials are ill suited for combat on land due to the aquatic life style. There's no evidence that False Gharial has killed a fisherman, all they found is some human remains in a gharial's stomache. Did they study the body? The only other cause of death I can think of is drowning. Why else would the fisherman disappear and then show up in a false gharial's stomach?
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Post by Ultimategrid on Jan 6, 2012 0:00:04 GMT -5
It has weak jaws COMPARED TO OTHER CROCODILIANS. It doesn't have weak jaws in general, it actually has rather strong jaws as far as animals go, but they simply aren't as strong as that of a crocodile or alligator. It has by far enough power to drag a jaguar into the water. Not excatly, it's jaws and teeth design is ill suited for dragging something large in the water. Also it is poorly design to holding a large struggling animal. It is not that uncommon for gharials to have jaws broken. You are confusing a Tomistoma for a Gharial. The animal we are dealing with here is a Tomistoma (False Gharial) which is quite well suited to pulling larger vertebrates into the water, animals around the size of deer are not uncommon. Gharials do break their jaws in territorial fights, but they have extremely weak jaws. Those of a Tomistoma are much stronger.
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Taurus
Invertebrate
Posts: 162
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Post by Taurus on Jan 6, 2012 13:00:37 GMT -5
No I am not confused a Tomistoma for a Gharial as it is still ill-suited to pull large vertbrates in the water and also the largest deer that a Tomistoma pulled was small 40lbs barking deer, much smaller than a 200lbs jaguar. Also Tomistoma's jaws are often broken or deformed, regardless of what species of Gharial.
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Taurus
Invertebrate
Posts: 162
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Post by Taurus on Jan 6, 2012 13:03:21 GMT -5
The problem with you use the term crocodilians in general. Gharials are quite different from caimans and crocodiles that other big cats deal with. Gharials are ill suited to tackle down large animals and they do poorly in interspecific conflicts. The only thing a gharial has is a size but that's it. Not mentioned that gharials are ill suited for combat on land due to the aquatic life style. There's no evidence that False Gharial has killed a fisherman, all they found is some human remains in a gharial's stomache. Did they study the body? The only other cause of death I can think of is drowning. Why else would the fisherman disappear and then show up in a false gharial's stomach? I don't think they did study on the body. Indian gharials are known for feeding on human corpses and it is not that rare. Hindu culture often set their dead loved ones drift in the rivers.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Jan 6, 2012 13:29:03 GMT -5
Did they study the body? The only other cause of death I can think of is drowning. Why else would the fisherman disappear and then show up in a false gharial's stomach? I don't think they did study on the body. Indian gharials are known for feeding on human corpses and it is not that rare. Hindu culture often set their dead loved ones drift in the rivers. Do they practice this in Malaysia and Indonesia?
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