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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 14:41:13 GMT -5
 The Pacific goliath grouper is found primarily in shallow tropical waters among coral and artificial reefs at depths of up to 165 feet (50 m). Their range includes the area from the Gulf of California to Peru. They may reach extremely large sizes, growing to lengths of 8.2 feet (2.5 m) and can weigh as much as 800 pounds (363 kg). They are usually around 400 lb when mature. vs  The Spectacled caiman is a small to mid-sized crocodilian. Males of the species are generally 1.8 to 2 m (5.9 to 6.6 ft), while females are smaller, usually around 1.2–1.4 m (3.9–4.6 ft). The body mass of most adult Spectacled caimans is between 7 and 40 kg (15 and 88 lb). The maximum reported size for the species is 2.5 m (8.2 ft), with a body mass of 58 kg (130 lb). |
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Post by Felis Rex on Apr 30, 2013 17:23:44 GMT -5
I have to give this one to the caiman for now, based on armor, jaw size and bite force.
I respectfully request some statistics on the groupers bite but general specs would be appreciated.
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Post by Pakman on Apr 30, 2013 17:30:44 GMT -5
Isn't this a mismatch? The grouper outweighs the caiman by hundreds of pounds.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Apr 30, 2013 17:54:13 GMT -5
Isn't this a mismatch? The grouper outweighs the caiman by hundreds of pounds. Can it swallow the caiman whole? can it kill it with one bite? is it somehow going to crush the caiman with its weight advantage? |
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Post by Pakman on Apr 30, 2013 19:15:03 GMT -5
I have to give this one to the caiman for now, based on armor, jaw size and bite force. I respectfully request some statistics on the groupers bite but general specs would be appreciated. The grouper's body is too massive for the small caiman to wrap his jaws around |
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Post by Felis Rex on Apr 30, 2013 20:00:52 GMT -5
even at parity?
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Apr 30, 2013 20:08:44 GMT -5
I have to give this one to the caiman for now, based on armor, jaw size and bite force. I respectfully request some statistics on the groupers bite but general specs would be appreciated. The grouper's body is too massive for the small caiman to wrap his jaws around It can still bite off its fines and bite its tail, It my not be able to crush this fish bute if it can cause a bad enough wound the fish can still bleed to death. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 20:16:21 GMT -5
V. Dragon are you backing the caiman?
I had a feeling most would favor the crocodilian but it should be noted that grouper average much bigger then the caiman and have a very big gape and powerful throat muscles that can crush at high force. They can swallow sharks and even small turtles whole. All it needs is to catch the caimans head and things are bad for the reptile. These groupers are very impressive fish.
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Reticulatus
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Post by Reticulatus on Apr 30, 2013 20:22:06 GMT -5
At parity the caiman can win but for the most part it would indeed be swallowed whole. Grouper don't pack a lot of psi or have impressive teeth but as bony fish go they have a decent set. These bad boys engulf their prey whole vacuum style, bony plates in the mouth and throat crush down and hold the victim fast. Actual consumtion of prey can be time consuming but they can ultimately devour anything smaller than their selves. Perhaps a caimen could strike an unweary grouper but I more often see the reverse. Idealy the fish would want the reptile head first safely shiething its wicked jaws in its belly.
A dusk grouper or perhaps even a Queensland grouper may be the better choice.
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Venomous Dragon
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Apr 30, 2013 20:22:55 GMT -5
V. Dragon are you backing the caiman? I had a feeling most would favor the crocodilian but it should be noted that grouper average much bigger then the caiman and have a very big gape and powerful throat muscles that can crush at high force. They can swallow sharks and even small turtles whole. All it needs is to catch the caimans head and things are bad for the reptile. These groupers are very impressive fish. Right now im just trying to defend the legitimacy of your match up. |
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Post by Felis Rex on Apr 30, 2013 21:20:33 GMT -5
Caiman do take fairly sizable prey, capybara average about 108lbs.
Caiman do come across as the "butt-monkeys" of the Amazon basin in terms of mega fauna. Documentary film makers seem to prefer to use them to show how formidable other species are (jaguar, anaconda electric eel etc.)
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Post by Pakman on Apr 30, 2013 23:04:47 GMT -5
the grouper will use his weight to ram and crush the smaller caiman
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2013 14:31:40 GMT -5
Caiman do take fairly sizable prey, capybara average about 108lbs. Caiman do come across as the "butt-monkeys" of the Amazon basin in terms of mega fauna. Documentary film makers seem to prefer to use them to show how formidable other species are (jaguar, anaconda electric eel etc.) Spectacled caiman are not known to regularly prey on adult capybara. They only eat young ones and maybe take an adult once in a blue moon. |
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