|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 16, 2012 7:46:31 GMT -5
I wouldnt say apes are weak fighters but they are bad killers and most of the fights we do are to the death. So just because an ape failed to kill somebody it sucks at killing? An old man once survived getting repeatedly smashed around by a bull. Does that mean bulls suck at killing? See this is the kind of nonsense that damages the Con-Ape side of the argument. There's a good amount of conflict between apes as well. Silverback Gorillas are an excellent example of a protective male. They can grow immensely ferocious when their families are threatened and fight to the death to protect the troop. From poachers, predators, or other silverbacks. The Gorilla isn't overrated either. In fact, few people appreciate what the greatest of apes is capable of. Here is some proof: www.montana.edu/cpa/news/nwview.php?article=3827 Grizzly is tested to have the strength of 2.5-5 men www.seaworld.org/animal-info/info-books/gorilla/physical-characteristics.htm An adult gorilla's upper body strength is six times more powerful than that of an adult human - enabling them to lift, break, and squeeze heavy objects. www.awf.org/content/wildlife/detail/mountaingorilla Male silverback gorillas can weigh 50-100 pounds more - and are about 10 times stronger - than the biggest American football players. A Gorilla is p4p as strong if not stronger than a grizzly bear. This doesn't fit the definition of the weak, clumsy incompetent that haters portray them as.
|
|
|
Post by Tyrannosaurus on Jun 16, 2012 15:37:01 GMT -5
That was probably a small grizzly, grizzlies strength is not easily tested, and last I checked "man" is not a standard unit of measurement. Depending on how you define "man", 3 men and 6 men could actually be the same. Show me one account of Gorillas fighting to the death. They usually just wrestle rival gorillas into submission or drive them off. Silverbacks have been known to intimidate leopards, but if a fight ensues even the largest silverbacks would be in considerable danger. 10 times stronger than the biggest football players? Bullshit, that's 1 and a half tons. Your implying that a gorilla can lift a small pickup truck.
|
|
Venomous Dragon
Archeon
The Varanid
The Ora, King of The Lizards.
Posts: 2,037
|
Post by Venomous Dragon on Jun 17, 2012 17:47:36 GMT -5
I wouldnt say apes are weak fighters but they are bad killers and most of the fights we do are to the death. So just because an ape failed to kill somebody it sucks at killing? An old man once survived getting repeatedly smashed around by a bull. Does that mean bulls suck at killing? See this is the kind of nonsense that damages the Con-Ape side of the argument. Bulls are rather inefficient killers too, most animals that arnt adapted to kill are not terribly good at it. Have you ever heard of a herbivore that regularly kills animals of simliar size in combat sitiuations? I havent. So what if a got thrashed by a bull and lived Ive heard of dogs that have been shot,stabbed and/or hit by a car/truck and lived.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 17, 2012 21:49:47 GMT -5
Every animal has a kill instinct. If it feels threatened it will kill. The whole idea of apes being poor killers is idiotic. They are basically saying just because an ape seriously injured but didn't kill somebody means they are poor killers. So what if a chimp failed to kill somebody? Humans have survived maulings from multiple lions and still survived. Travis the chimp took knives and gunshots. So how does it make sense a predator can kill a gorilla swiftly with little resistance?
Just because apes lack predatory weapons and the like, people assume they are weak as tissue paper.
How do certain people "know" for a fact an ape can't eye-gouge, strange, or use its brains to outwit a dumber opponent? Do people really think apes are incapable of what they are clearly anatomically built to do?
There's no strong reasoning behind this Ape-hatred people seem to have. I really don't understand it. If apes are so vulnerable, predators would find them easier prey and hunt them to extinction. But that clearly isn't the case.
Talk about disrespect man. Geez
|
|
Venomous Dragon
Archeon
The Varanid
The Ora, King of The Lizards.
Posts: 2,037
|
Post by Venomous Dragon on Jun 17, 2012 23:08:13 GMT -5
No not every animal have a "kill instinct" Every animal does have survival instincts and if killing there attack is the only way to live than thats what they will try to do but its not the same thing as a "kill instinct". I never said apes are "weak as tissue paper" but I did say they were poor killers and as far as I can tell they are. I do not hate apes, just because I dont think they can kill effectively does not mean I hate them. I have never seen an account of an ape killing any animal close to its size quickly, Preditors on the other hand do so regularly. There is no disrespect only a difference of opinions.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 17, 2012 23:31:53 GMT -5
It's not just apes actually. About 90% of all herbivores are underrated. And check this out: www.malamala.com/MM7/LEOP_hlarulini.htm Baboon inflicted massive injuries on a leopard. Based on that, what could a 450LB alpha gorilla do with the same mentality?
|
|
Venomous Dragon
Archeon
The Varanid
The Ora, King of The Lizards.
Posts: 2,037
|
Post by Venomous Dragon on Jun 17, 2012 23:59:03 GMT -5
Baboons are packing serious teeth and some of those are not even confirmed as baboon caused deaths (one is under debate according to your link). I personally would favour a baboon over a similarly sized ape. These accounts although impressive on the baboons behalf ( even though most still lost there fights and were eaten) do not give any credit to apes just to baboons. A gorilla killing a cat far smaller would not be immensly impressive nor would it prove me wrong and from the accounts ive seen leopards dont go down easy, even to silverbacks.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 18, 2012 6:24:18 GMT -5
See you proved my point. When something defeats a cat, people question its reliability. When a cat defeats something, it's assumed the conquered animal is 100% fine and uncompromised.
Gorilla would utterly brutalize and destroy a leopard face to face. He's 2-3 times bigger, much stronger, longer reach, better dexterity, smarter, the advantages are endless. How would it not dominate? This is not up for debate. Leopards only prey on females and young. Not healthy alpha gorillas in face to face daylight. Gorillas can barely see anything at night.
You dislike apes, VD. Don't be two-faced and just admit it. I admit right now I strongly dislike felines.
What exactly is so hard to believe about ape eye-gouging or using sticks as weapons anyway? Going by some of these haters advices, what exactly ARE apes capable of? Merely flailing stupidly like a little girl?
No. Just a bunch of ape haters spreading lies and false data. Truly sad and pitiable. Now you know why I called Carnivora an Internet Zombie Apocalypse. Just a mob determined to squelch out all opposition
|
|
|
Post by DinosaurMichael on Jun 18, 2012 6:35:19 GMT -5
See you proved my point. When something defeats a cat, people question its reliability. When a cat defeats something, it's assumed the conquered animal is 100% fine and uncompromised. Gorilla would utterly brutalize and destroy a leopard face to face. He's 2-3 times bigger, much stronger, longer reach, better dexterity, smarter, the advantages are endless. How would it not dominate? This is not up for debate. Leopards only prey on females and young. Not healthy alpha gorillas in face to face daylight. Gorillas can barely see anything at night. You dislike apes, VD. Don't be two-faced and just admit it. I admit right now I strongly dislike felines. What exactly is so hard to believe about ape eye-gouging or using sticks as weapons anyway? Going by some of these haters advices, what exactly ARE apes capable of? Merely flailing stupidly like a little girl? No. Just a bunch of ape haters spreading lies and false data. Truly sad and pitiable. Now you know why I called Carnivora an Internet Zombie Apocalypse. Just a mob determined to squelch out all opposition Believe me Jumbo1. Venomous Dragon doesn't dislike Apes. He's just stating his opinion about them. That's all.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 18, 2012 6:40:12 GMT -5
VD thinks a Gorilla is barely a match to a leopard 1/2-1/3rd its size. He also thinks apes suck at killing just because a human survived an ape attack. Would someone who doesn't dislike apes say this kind of stuff?
Me? I admit 100% I do not like felines. I don't pretend to like an animal when I really do not.
|
|
|
Post by DinosaurMichael on Jun 18, 2012 6:42:10 GMT -5
VD thinks a Gorilla is barely a match to a leopard 1/2-1/3rd its size. He also thinks apes suck at killing just because a human survived an ape attack. Would someone who doesn't dislike apes say this kind of stuff? Me? I admit 100% I do not like felines. I don't pretend to like an animal when I really do not. Well if that's what you think. It's alright. And I do agree with you that a Leopard is no match against a Silverback face to face.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 18, 2012 6:48:08 GMT -5
You're 100% right D. Mike. For a leopard to defeat a gorilla would be like me taking on a 270LB ripped guy who is also much smarter than I am.
|
|
|
Post by DinosaurMichael on Jun 18, 2012 6:49:40 GMT -5
You're 100% right D. Mike. For a leopard to defeat a gorilla would be like me taking on a 270LB ripped guy who is also much smarter than I am. Indeed.
|
|
|
Post by jumbo1 on Jun 18, 2012 7:54:09 GMT -5
But I think the most underrated animal in Africa by FAR is the wildebeest. They've deterred lions on multiple instances.
|
|
|
Post by Super Communist on Jun 18, 2012 10:40:05 GMT -5
90 percent of the members in carnivora don't rate humans highly as fighters, does that make them human haters?
|
|